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 Attacking info 
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Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:35 am
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Why is it when I attack with 125 attack and 25 defence and the opponent has 30 attack and 12 defence I lose? I get beaten by people with much lower stats. why is that?


Sat Jul 17, 2010 4:09 am
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Gaijiin wrote:
Why is it when I attack with 125 attack and 25 defence and the opponent has 30 attack and 12 defence I lose? I get beaten by people with much lower stats. why is that?

The new battle system bases the amount of damage you take by your decks and defense. So the more decks you have the more damage you take, this was implemented to make crew more valuable.

If you get some better defense modules and some extra hull youll be fine.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 4:21 am
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wait, so the more ship size I have, the more damage i take????


Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:12 am
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Gaijiin wrote:
wait, so the more ship size I have, the more damage i take????



yup, so to win attack/defence game, you should only have <10 decks and attack everybody with 30+ :D

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:13 am
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thats just retarded, its not even realistic..


Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:15 am
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To tell you guys the truth, if you invest your deck (in a PVP situation) accordingly, (AKA have up to par defense, attack, hull, and/or shield modules) the only unfair thing youll come across is that you cant 1 hit small ships.

As for realism, its all how you look at it. Your assuming that before this update your ship rarely missed/made crappy shots. But if you assume that you never had good targeting it makes perfect sense, bigger target better chances of hitting and thusly more lasers hit, and more lasers hit well.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:16 am
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I dont know much about the pvp aspect of this game, but im guessing in order to defend the good planets I get, Im gonna need to have shitloads of attack and shitloads of defence, but being beat my a ship that has much less att/def is just plain retarded.


Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:22 am
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Gaijiin wrote:
wait, so the more ship size I have, the more damage i take????

No, the damage you take should be the same, unless you are being hit capped damage. If so, put more defenses

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:29 am
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Gaijiin wrote:
I dont know much about the pvp aspect of this game, but im guessing in order to defend the good planets I get, Im gonna need to have shitloads of attack and shitloads of defence, but being beat my a ship that has much less att/def is just plain retarded.

ok 2 things...
1: As a mod im gong to have to ask you to stop using "retarded".
2: You take more damage. but if you stay up to par with your modules youll be fine.
The rate at which you take more damage for each deck you have is smaller then the rate at which you gain HP/reduce damage taken. AKA for every 5 decks the damage you take is X.02 but for every rank you go up the module par increases your HP and defenses X.05 per rank. (if you stay on par)
So yes if you dont have much HP/defenses for your rank, your in trouble. But if you get close to your par everything will be ok.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:30 am
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Barracuda wrote:
Gaijiin wrote:
wait, so the more ship size I have, the more damage i take????

No, the damage you take should be the same, unless you are being hit capped damage. If so, put more defenses

wait, what? ok im going to do some tests and read up on the patch notes.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:32 am
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Ok so ya barracuda is right. wow so um...isnt like half the arguments about this whole change now invalid? Man we gotta read patch notes better.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:35 am
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if the admin is confused, what am I?


Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:43 am
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Gaijiin wrote:
if the admin is confused, what am I?

im not an admin. im a mod. and the only title that would really make a difference would be developer so meh.

EDIT: Well actually if im correct on this, then my previous statement still holds some fact to it.
Now I know that with the new patch more decks=higher damage cap. I dont know how the equation for battle works, or how exactly this new patch has changed that. but I do have a theory.
I believe that the battle equation eventually ends up with a %. This % (AKA X%) then goes into this equation.

Damage Cap*X%=Damage Taken

If this is infact true then with every deck added without the appropriate amount of defense added to compensate for the increased amount of decks, each new deck will increase the damage you take.

So now the question is did I already figure this out and I forgot it? Or did I make some stupid assumptions and just no figured it out. hmmmmmmmmmmm......

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:03 am
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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:25 am
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Quote:
If this is infact true then with every deck added without the appropriate amount of defense added to compensate for the increased amount of decks, each new deck will increase the damage you take.


I think this is what Dan was talking about in this quote from a reply to a question on ship defenses in the strategy hub...

Quote:
Yes, stacking shield and armor without too much defense is not a good idea


So you would be correct then if I am reading this correctly...

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:41 am
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so then if you put an appropriate amount of research into defense, low ranks should not be able to beat you in a fight. This I infact have proof of.
(Rank 5 guy)
13 Attack
?? Deck
?? Defense

(Me)
726 Attack
745 Deck
799 Defense

like this I did 15 damage to him he did 1 to me.

After reducing my defense to 187, 15 damage to him -7 to me.

And after reducing my attack down to 60, 12 damage to him -1 to me.

So low ranks will not be able to beat you in a fair fight (fair meaning you both have modules that are on par)

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:50 am
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Quote:
Yes, stacking shield and armor without too much defense is not a good idea

WAS
This was before the change where doubling your shield+hull could make you lose 2x more hp if defenses are insufficient. Ceiling damage was calculated as a percentage of hull+shield, thus adding more = more damage. (lousy system)
ALSO, normal damage is calculated the same way. Example, same defender/attacker 500 hulls+Shield = 50 damage.
Doubling the hulls and shield to 1000 --- = 85-105 damage. (Almost double or double, thus the hulls and shield was 10000% useless in Pvp in the past)

NOW
Now, the damage is based on decks, so it is more realistic (bigger size = higher ceiling damage, not damage taken)
Doubling your hull/shields will not make you get hit higher damage. IF it does, then my testing is flawed as I am taking less than 20% difference in damage.

What people are complaining, a single shot and small ships should blow up instantaneously. In the past, assuming your target is 100% healthy, you will still need to shot it 5 times to kill it (Due to damage cap of 20-25% of total hull+Shields)
[Even if you had 2000000000000 attack and the defender has total 10 hull+shield, 0 defense.]
Those 1 shots are just because their targets are already weakened.



So, I have to conclude those who complain most probably has:
1. Too little defense
2. fight ships that are way too tiny
3. Upon seeing they are not hitting as big amount of damage, they feel cheated.
4. Did not experience sufficient combat experience prior to this update. In the past there WAS a Ceiling too....

Upon seeing your damage dealt is low, take this into account:
The small ship won't be able to get 1000 hulls, YOU CAN!
The small ship won't be able to fit so much modules, YOU CAN!
The small ship might not be able to fit all 5 sensors, YOU CAN!
The small ship can beat you up, so can you + add more hull+shields to absorb more impact.

You deal 50 damage and is dealt back 25... I had 10x more attack!
Think of it this way,
You are most probably dealing 10-40% of that ships maximum hull/shield, and you are only being dealt back 2.5% damage (assuming 1000 hull)
Repairs are based on hull %, not hull number. Count and think in percentage of damage dealt, not numbers

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:10 am
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Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:35 am
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is theyre a guide on the forums for a basic pvp guide? If not can someone post one?


Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:00 pm
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I dont think there should be a damage cap, with a damage cap, whats the point of getting better(Or more) weapons if it wont cause more damage?

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:04 pm
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Robert wrote:
I dont think there should be a damage cap, with a damage cap, whats the point of getting better(Or more) weapons if it wont cause more damage?

because it stops people from ganking as easily (if at the point in which you can do this, stop complaining its 10 more energy boo friking hoo.) As for doing more damage, fight against people at your strength and you wont have to worry about it.

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Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:55 pm
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