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Remove the Cap Production
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Author:  blabla [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Remove the Cap Production
Seems like the production Cap is probably relate with the richness of the planet or maybe something else if someone knows it

This unfair feature needs to be remove.

How can a x63 artifact top at 98k
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While a x59 top at 65k
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Author:  CapitainePaul [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
RICH people problems. No one cares.
Author:  blabla [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
CapitainePaul wrote:
RICH people problems. No one cares.


Yeah specialy CaptainTool, who add nothing to the debate or how the cap production is working
Author:  senatorhung [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
if there actually is a production cap, it would nerf whoever scripted the mythical 103x arti rift.

but from the other bozo discussion, it sounds more like there is actually a planet effects cap, not a planet production cap.
Author:  blabla [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
senatorhung wrote:
if there actually is a production cap, it would nerf whoever scripted the mythical 103x arti rift.

but from the other bozo discussion, it sounds more like there is actually a planet effects cap, not a planet production cap.


Well that could make sense, do you have more information about this potential effects cap ? I can try it once one of my effect ends
Author:  senatorhung [ Fri Oct 12, 2018 7:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
blabla wrote:
senatorhung wrote:
if there actually is a production cap, it would nerf whoever scripted the mythical 103x arti rift.

but from the other bozo discussion, it sounds more like there is actually a planet effects cap, not a planet production cap.


Well that could make sense, do you have more information about this potential effects cap ? I can try it once one of my effect ends

nope, as mentioned in the other discussion .. this bozo has no experience with 63x arti rifts. you'll have to ask the other bozo.
Author:  juiceman [ Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
so while I could certainly devil's advocate both sides...at a point not capping things leads to totally ridiculous things... one planet producing so much is insane...the prismatic is cruising in that direction...I guess if we all can get millions of ap more a day eventually it will be so mundane we will want no cap in order to feel special again... too much inflation leads to even more broken game mechanics...even 65k from a planet is silly...my 2 cents
Author:  Deigobene [ Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
I get what the Kool is saying but, for me, the mechanics *should* be the mechanics, because it can affect anyone, including those who need more AP, not just peeps with AP to burn.
In my case, for example, the losses are trivial compared to what I lose through sleep every night, but that's not really the point imo.

The problem occurs exactly the same on a 35x as it does on a 65x, so everyone is potentially affected, not just a lucky few with great planets.
If you invested all your time and effort on a 22x or less, you would probably run into exactly the same problem.
Hard to test, for obvious reasons, but if anyone wants to volunteer to try then please feel free to give me a yell and I will set up access to a cut and paste magical planet audit spreadsheet for you.

There is definitely a problem with the planet buffs: as near as I can tell it seems most likely on planets with Throne of the Revered, which generally are the planets you put the most work - and quite possibly GP - into. Whether this occurs on other planets is hard to test, because it is difficult to buff "secondary" planets to that level absent the Throne.

Best guess I could come up with using my planet audit spreadsheet geekery and testing over a number of kind volunteer participants, is that at some point (possibly over the 5x threshold) the multiplier incorrectly rounds down to the nearest whole number. This can mean a substantial hourly difference. Multiply that by days, months or years and it becomes more substantial.

For example, it seemed that something that should have been multiplying by 5.4 (or so) was actually generating 5x.
One that should have been at 6.35 (or so) was at 6.

So, a relatively young player who buffs their very best pride-and-joy 22x planet with Rings with their recently upgraded Throne and throws on all their limited temporary buffs is losing a substantial amount of AP each hour as well, especially for them. Their need for the extra AP they have should have earned may well be greater.

Whatever the problem is, I think it is always a little wrong to waste a player's limited temporary buffs regardless of what production the planet is providing.
The reason is simple: it affects anyone who has taken the time and effort to earn those temporary buffs.

TLDR: the problem is not confined to a lucky few, the multiplier cap is real and can affect anyone, including those who need the extra help the most.

Please note, the 35x of which I spoke earlier is my Throne planet, so any possible gain I would have from things working as the box says they should is pretty insignificant, especially given my hourly production (honestly you probably don't want to know) and nightly losses because I don't care to wake up every 5.5 hours unless there is a fire ;)
Author:  PLURVIOUS [ Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Guys, what we call "Dan Math" has been FUBAR for as long as I've been playing. Not just planet production, but everything. It's "close enough" in a lot of places, but the numbers don't - and never really - added up correctly.
Author:  Deigobene [ Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
PLURVIOUS wrote:
Guys, what we call "Dan Math" has been FUBAR for as long as I've been playing. Not just planet production, but everything. It's "close enough" in a lot of places, but the numbers don't - and never really - added up correctly.

Except they do. On every single planet I have... except the one with the Throne.

I won't bore you with too many details, but the spreadsheet I created takes the cut and paste of your planet, strips out everything, re-calculates everything from scratch based on the structures, multiplies back based on the effects and invariably places a happy little tick in the 3 little boxes for the 3 different production types to indicate that the expected value based on those calculations is the same as the value reported from the cut and paste. Except for planets with the Throne.

Knowing that, I feel pretty confident in saying it's not just a case of "Dan Math" "never really" adding up correctly, because that just ain't the case.
I can show the working for several hundred planets to disprove the incorrect notion that the numbers never add up.
Happy for someone to run a calculator manually and triple check over every one of those 400+ planet calculations if they like, but I wouldn't recommend it because there is only one where the results differ from the expected value that the structures and effects suggest.
You guessed it, it's the planet with the Throne :)

On planets without the Throne, the most it has ever missed by is 1, which happens once every few blue moons and is surely the case of me guessing the method of rounding, trimming or however the final, many decimal points of the values are changed to be presented as a whole number.

It is the same spreadsheet audit I used to identify and prove conclusively to Support that the shipyard originally ceased to produce at all when its charges were exhausted.
This resulted in it being fixed within days.

Ticks everywhere, over more than 400 planets, except for the single planet with the Throne.
Author:  juiceman [ Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
sounds like a sexy spreadsheet...I love smart people!!
Author:  SpiralEyes [ Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
juiceman wrote:
sounds like a sexy spreadsheet...I love smart people!!


Having copied and pasted my rift into Deigos spreadsheet, I can confirm that it is indeed a sexy spreadsheet. :ugeek:
Author:  Farfel [ Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Throne... Pfffff Farf far from a throne. Just build watch crap grow daily and lick the galaxy, the rest should sort itself out... If not I am pretty sure it is all Kool's Fault!!!!
Author:  free0bird [ Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Basicly since this is a problem with the throne alone a support ticket should suffice. Since its proven the throne is at fault
Author:  juiceman [ Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
farf..of course its my fault!!!!! but I have to play it close to the hilt
Author:  Thaumanovic [ Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
SpiralEyes wrote:
juiceman wrote:
sounds like a sexy spreadsheet...I love smart people!!


Having copied and pasted my rift into Deigos spreadsheet, I can confirm that it is indeed a sexy spreadsheet. :ugeek:

Is there a chance that this sexy spreadsheet is public?
Author:  Deigobene [ Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Guide wrote:
SpiralEyes wrote:
juiceman wrote:
sounds like a sexy spreadsheet...I love smart people!!


Having copied and pasted my rift into Deigos spreadsheet, I can confirm that it is indeed a sexy spreadsheet. :ugeek:

Is there a chance that this sexy spreadsheet is public?

I spent (too many) hours/days creating and testing with a view to a public release and have been using it now for a year or so.
Has behaved remarkably well for me over that time, but cannot guarantee anything for anyone else :)
I had planned to add some more sexy crap to it, but work got in the way and I just haven't got around to it

That said, if you want a copy for your own planet logs and logistics of arti placement etc and are reasonably comfortable with google sheets than I am happy to make an empty duplicate so you can download to your own drive and take it for a spin.
Author:  blabla [ Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Deigobene wrote:
Guide wrote:
SpiralEyes wrote:

Having copied and pasted my rift into Deigos spreadsheet, I can confirm that it is indeed a sexy spreadsheet. :ugeek:

Is there a chance that this sexy spreadsheet is public?

I spent (too many) hours/days creating and testing with a view to a public release and have been using it now for a year or so.
Has behaved remarkably well for me over that time, but cannot guarantee anything for anyone else :)
I had planned to add some more sexy crap to it, but work got in the way and I just haven't got around to it

That said, if you want a copy for your own planet logs and logistics of arti placement etc and are reasonably comfortable with google sheets than I am happy to make an empty duplicate so you can download to your own drive and take it for a spin.


I would love to have it to if you are willing to share
Author:  Thaumanovic [ Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Remove the Cap Production
Deigobene wrote:
That said, if you want a copy for your own planet logs and logistics of arti placement etc and are reasonably comfortable with google sheets than I am happy to make an empty duplicate so you can download to your own drive and take it for a spin.

Yes please, I'd appreciate that very much.

I'll be honest, I'm actually looking for a copy more to see what kind of wizardry went into it, rather than using it to track planets, but I suppose it'd help me be less lazy about that.
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