bobsmith,

Please give me a link to your thread.

Thanks.

~JF~

Well i found some of your posts:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2924

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3035


Reading though them, you have said about them but nothing compared to what i have done.

You have done a poll with what would you like to see next, but thats it with phew ideas.
Also you miss understand me, and miss read.

I SAID:

"I can't claim it is all my ideas"

And i can't find any other threads with the same ideas.

i quote

"The legion warehouse thread gave me an idea. Why not have an entire planet, or even solar system that a legion could occupy, something much bigger that you could put a lot of structures on, or dock your ships. Within this planet you could keep a warehouse for artifacts. There could also be incentive to raid others base planets for loot or points or something. Aside from an aggressive standpoint maybe you could visit others bases in order to trade or something similar.

Instead of the entire base being up for grabs maybe you could just make it permanent to that Legion and if it were attacked, it would need repairs or some equivalent. On the flip side if it were permanent, upgrades could be implemented and donations from members. I think this could really expand the value of legions."

Compare your details and content with mine?

~JF~

Any way time to stop this silly argument and as you "started" this but not "finished" it, shall i put you into the hall of fame for helping with the general idea

~JF@

The idea sounds interesting.

If your going to press, then press on heh...All this is from the previous threads.

1."The legion warehouse thread gave me an idea. Why not have an entire planet, or even solar system that a legion could occupy, something much bigger that you could put a lot of structures on, or dock your ships. Within this planet you could keep a warehouse for artifacts. There could also be incentive to raid others base planets for loot or points or something. Aside from an aggressive standpoint maybe you could visit others bases in order to trade or something similar."

This encompasses your planet section "The planet size has to be big" yea this sounds familiar, only giving it specific number in which case I never do. Thats for the developers to decide what exact details they want to maintain balance within the game.

2."Instead of the entire base being up for grabs maybe you could just make it permanent to that Legion and if it were attacked, it would need repairs or some equivalent. On the flip side if it were permanent, upgrades could be implemented and donations from members. I think this could really expand the value of legions."

Now we are on to donations and permanent structures that need upgrades.

3."To add on to this idea, there could be base technologies that could be researched. Like base shields weapons, etc. Have a bigger trade market, more room for ships. This really could go a lot of places."

Further expansion onto base upgrades. Including the idea of a trade-able market.

4."I actually am leaning more towards the bases being publicly known, or at least having an option to let who you want know and then cloak against others. I'm not sure what all you can do with a market, but I like the idea of being able to trade with others. Maybe have businesses and be able to sell your own stuff to others."

Cloaking section.....

5."If we use the idea of legion starbases, then we could treat it as a player instead, where you can attack and raid it in PvP and the starbase can have its own cargo and decks. This also allows for it to be scalable unlike planets are."

Improvement upon the planet base since I favor starbases. Starbases can expand, where as planets generally do not.

6."I was thinking about this a little more, another addition to the station (yes it's been upgraded to a station as opposed to a base) could be a repair bay. Maybe you could have discounted repairs within it. To elaborate on the market portion, maybe you could sell planet locations, or extra npc parts, artifact points etc. Also, maybe a bar that would have a bounty hunter list that you could pay."

Further ideas that you haven't utilized.

7."I like the idea of it acting as a starbase myself, and that starbase acts as a player in regards to size and growth, that way it isnt limited like planets as previously mentioned. Maybe the planets in the starbase system can act as resource gatherers for that specific base, and those planets would act under normal conditions.
"

Possible methods your base can gather resources apart from doantions...

8."Perhaps each legion member would "donate" one of their unused planets (we all got 'em) to the starbase. Bigger the legion, bigger the system. One member would be official starbase commander (legion would decide who and how). Commander would be responsible for resource allocation, planetary development, etc..
"

The introduction of starbase leadership and a combination of donations and resource use.

9."A friend and I were discussing a idea for a new type of game enhancement for internal legion interaction. Like elite NPCs, legion members would contribute research points towards a common goal like a new type of weapon, defense, or artifact. Top contributing members would receive higher bonuses. It would be just like NPC elite shares only involving research points instead of combat.
"

Further details of donations.

10."When I originally posted it, i laid out some pretty extensive plans, maybe you missed it:P

Some of which included, having Bob's bar for bounty hunters (yea I just gave it a name) where you could visit the local bar, talk to other people and place bounties on peoples heads or see what bounties there were to collect yourself.

A place to dock your ship, possible reduced repair costs depending on upgradeable portions of your station.

A market where you can buy and sell goods maybe even set up a shop of your own to sell items.

Boards for that specific legion so they can post what they are currently doing, if they are recruiting and so forth.

The warehouse of course to house and store items.

Then the pvp component where you can attack and defend the base, either for some form of monetary bonus, or just some kind of leaderboard function.

I think this is plenty to start from, it can easily evolve from this."

Yet another very short summary outlining some uses for the base.

11."If the base is taken in the direction where others can visit then sure it should be found. I had proposed the idea of having some form of list of those who were allowed in, maybe they would have to ask for access. Those who were not allowed in would have to scan for the base, which of course requires you to up your cloak on the base.

Further cloaking details.

12."The bases should be extremely hard to take down, it should take a coordinated group effort, and maybe take time to repair to even further limit how many times it can be attacked. If it is difficult enough then actions wouldn't be needed. But there should be enough benefits to being friendly with someone's base as being enemies with it, that way people really have to decide whether or not its worth it to be friend or foe."

Further detail in regards to Dan's proposed questions to the thread.

13."If the legion disbands, it should be powered down and the scavengers take over taking it away piece by piece."

Another question asked by Dan and answered.

14."Yea along these lines, my original idea was not to limit it to a planet, but to make it a station. Something like the Renegar Lazuli Station, but you could colonize planets specifically to be used by the station. So the station would act as a giant player collecting planets and increasing its own resources. Everything on a much larger scale of course. I like the idea of group missions for the base or as a separate idea altogether, could be something new and fun."

Again, emphasizing resource collecting and the beginnings of group missions involving the Legion Bases.

14."I was thinking of these as permanent bases, not something that could be stolen. The idea being you could reduce it's defenses to zero and raid it's warehouse and whatnot, but not actually take it. This also helps for legions that go through players like revolving doors. They may not be able to hold onto players but at least they would have something permanent for their efforts. These things should be massive and take immense amounts of work. Maybe if people had their ships stored there when it was taken the ships could also be blown up, like if your in the station it's a no trap zone."

Some points of having the bases along with some pvp implications.

15."Also, this base is where officers can approve alliances, NAP, and declare war. Thus expanding both diplomatic options as well as open warfare."

There are a lot more posts about tying the diplomacy actions directly to the bases such as this one.

16."As to the point of the taxes again(which seems to be the only slight change to the original idea), the original idea was to have a limit say the next level of research was 0/1000000, you could donate research if you wanted to do that on an individual basis, the amount you could donate would be proportional either to your level or your max research, limiting your donation to once a day. This allows people to donate if they have the resources and not be burdened by having a tax. It also limits the amount one person can donate so that the people who are finished with research can't just dump everything they have into it all at once. It will perpetuate itself because the game is competitive in nature and people will want to keep up their level with opposing legions. This also allows those who may not normally partake in pvp, or cannot help kill npc's at particular hours to be able to add their value to the legion. This can add an attribute to a person that legions will find beneficial if they choose to apply to various legions or when determining if a person is actually helping the legion evolve. "

Directly taken from this post which now I've seen you have added.

17. Further and even older topics about this viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1969

18. And another viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1939

This is only some of the things I took 5 minutes to find, there is far more out there. So don't make some stupid reply and copy and paste one thing and say yours is totally original. If you really wanted to move on from this, you would not have posted something like that, especially since you didn't have the courtesy to actually look into it.

So once again the only thing I see thats new is taxes, which I do not like the idea of at all. And possibly placing the leader in control of everything which I also do not like. Look at Mjohn or whatever his name was who disbanded his whole legion because he thought it was funny. Now take something a group of people have worked long and hard for and implement the funny man.

There is no way one person should have complete control over something like this, too much can go wrong.

bob i give up arguing with you.

If you got nothing good to say, say nothing at all.

If you did all this work as you "said" you have done, then i would guest that idea would of already
been put into place?

But enough is enough, i dont care any more. i constructed this thread. unless you going to
improve it, but in a fair way, then just dont post.

~Many Thanks~

~JF~

I think this could work well with wars too; Legions can only see each other's planet/base if they declare war, they defend it as a planet, with whatever's built on it like you said, and can take all the stuff in the stores by "raiding", which should encompass research, minerals, and artifacts (because you should need to disable the players, unlike with hacking in PvP). And, when declaring a war, the leaders should need to agree on a specific amount of resources to be in the planets storehouses (maybe, maybe not). So yeah, I think it's a good idea, and I'd like them to add official wars to it, because it seems perfect for that sort of thing.

While I have often found myself disagreeing with Bob, on this occasion I do have to agree with him. The only "New Idea!" (that you claim in the thread title) is the really bad idea of Taxes. As Bob said, there are numerous threads with the idea of a legion starbase/station/planet. They have been discussed ad nauseum. Some of the ideas are good, some are bad, some are just ridiculous. I applaud the effort you put into "creating" an organized, concise post, but it is 90%... well... plagiarized, I guess one could say. It amounts to basically a Cliff's Notes version of several threads. The ideas you put forth have already been discussed, reviewed (I'm sure) by the development gang, and deemed not worthy for inclusion in the game at this time. Your argumentative and critical attitude with Bob, a rational and experienced player/poster, is completely ludicrous.

"New Idea" in the title was because, its HOW the legion planet could be made.
Its not "New legion planet idea". Because of that i put new in it.

The taxes are for fairness, yes it could be made for "donation only" but then some days the legion base would get
nothing, some days it would get loads. but there would be more days of it getting nothing then getting money.

The other thing is, its going have its "own" research, this idea makes it so you can "share" research points.
Unlike other ideas where you "Give" research points to fund the planet. how ever, this would favour higher ranks with
better research planet than lower ranks making this idea unfair for all.

by doing that you have to have your own research on the planet and can't donate research points, makes
it fair for all. The taxes also come into this because your "reserving points" to get better research for the planet,
to get more points.

This is the same for artifact points and mining points, all designed to reserve points to make the planet better.

The only tax what effects the players of the legion is the mineral tax, i understand that every one in GL wants it to be removed
how ever, this would upset the balance of the game. there would be to much Credits being created then being used.

It would make all items "cheap" and the game would get boring fast, because you have everything that you wanted.

To side with both dan and GL members, a 50/50 tax (10%/10%) would be best effective as only 10% is wasted out of
the 90% you sell, the other 10% goes to the planet to be used, for something useful.

Either that or have tax at 20% still and another upto 30% on top.
Or donating and that goes back the the other problem, the planet wouldn't get enough Credits
to build.

I am aware of other threads, how ever if you shall take one minute to scan forums.
there is "nothing" all in one place, not what i've found. Its all either section of notes, in "Many Threads".
Or one thread saying "well with the legion base, it could/should have cloak like planetary cloak currently".
And others like it.

Where i have been different, instead of could/should. "its the cloak is 10 per member in the legion."
This allows the cloaking to be not to powerful that you can't find legion bases, but not to weak you
always scan them and not other good planets.

Its all about balance.

Regarding bobsmith, i've had problem with her/him before.
Because of that and he/she criticizing my thread, was the limit.

If you can find me 1 thread, with everything is in the first post, like mine.
With detailed information about each bit, like cloak, names, size, resources, building it up, ect.
And i expect that with the details, it would be "fair" for all and got some maths in there.
To help dan construct it, Example:

"4.1 Legions Cargo

The legion cargo is to hold the minerals and artifacts.
It is Average legion rank, times legion size, times legion bonus = amount of cargo space."

If its MUCH older than mine, then i'll say fine, older post should be looked at before mine.
If not, please dont moan that theres many ideas like this one out there, because dan, and hes team wont
have time to search though all of forums looking for different thread and trying to piece them together.

i should know, i go looking for stuff on the internet and i dont have time to piece everything together.

to take a break from the current argument,

for docking ships on this planet or starbase, i propose that if a player is guarding a planet or not guarding anything and then becomes disabled, they are instantly transported to the planet/starbase. they will be repaired by 50% per hour, and then once they are fully repaired they will be guarding the legion base, having their stats added to the attack/defense/cloak of the starbase.

when other players look at the starbase they could see who is guarding the base and who is currently being repaired. Also, for ships that are guarding, they can be targeted individually but the legion bases attack/defense/cloak bonus is applied to the ships current stats. this way legion bases dont turn into an exotica situation where it is virtually impossible to bring it down. this would still require legion tactical strikes because they only have 2 hours to disable the players and bring down the base before the ships are repaired and begin guarding again.

Once the base is down production is halved, and a percentage is instantly raided from the storehouses. in addition, until the base is repaired the other half of the production will go towards the winning legion bases production.

Guarding ships will have no disable limit, but their raid/hack counters can still be zeroed out. this prevents zeroed out players from guarding and not being able to be disabled. No ships will be able to be repaired by the base while the base is disabled. all ships will be expelled from the base if it becomes disabled, and cannot return to guard it until if is fully repaired. This can either come from the bases production, or from players willing to donate to the base..

No. Legion planet that can be Fluxed . No. NO. NOO!

Thanks for your input.

Some of your ideas could work, but others i would say, is a no go.

If the planet has 200 structure space, and at the current rate of 2 spaces for 200 attack or defense, putting guarding on the planet would make it impossible to take down.

With auto repair, if a legion is out to destroy you, or your proud of your states but your under attack. the last thing you want, is the repair slowly repairing your ship so people can disabled you again. and having a no zero limit, some states could go from dangerous to balanced, very fast.

Regarding cloaking, each planet should have the same "cloaking abilities" of each other, to much cloak would mean that legion planet is never found, what of course. with wars and all thats, people wants to find it. thats why 10 cloak per member in the legion as passive cloak, would be best. so not even the most powerful legions and hide their planet.

How ever i do agree that, once the planet has been wiped out to below then 10 population, that there should be some sort of penalty.
But nothing like, the resources are zero for (what ever time) because the planet should still be raidable, and the enemy should still get resources from it.

~JF~

Well yes, if your legion planet is found, you would like to flux it.
This would make it exciting because you might only have a limited amount of time to hit the planet.
All i would say is, all artifacts apart from defensive and offensive boost artifacts Plus population boosting ones, can be used.
(special buildings like phase cutter does not count as a offensive artifact)

so that would be:

terrformings
fluxes
special buildings
ion storm
and more, can be used.

With this idea, i'm trying to keep it fair, fair enough so rank 30's has the same fairness as rank 500's.
Thats why with building stuff with credits are worked out on averages.

~JF~

I think it'd be more fun if they used the planet for wars, instead of letting it be found like another planet. It seems like they need to implement something involving a war sometime, and this might be the best way to do it. Then it's just two Legions trying to defend their base from each other, instead of just random people attacking it sometimes.

i would like to see them on the battle tab, as was previously stated in another forum. maybe 2 legion bases can be seen at a time and refresh after 12 hours. the only difference is they can be alerted without any offensive action done on the player. that way casual wars can occur. that way a maximum of 100 legion bases can be seen at once with a full legion combined. i know it seems like alot, but there are literally THOUSANDS of one man legions out there, so its really not that many. there would be no rank restriction on finding bases preferably, but if a cap is preferred then i would say have it based on the average rank of the top 3 players. this would prevent really high level legions from getting 4 or 5 level 1s to drop em down.